The Giants of LOP Fall
Article supplied by Tshepo Ditshego
The second half of the LOP season got off to an unlikely start after a long 1 and a half month break. One would think that after the Slam da Trash festival both Wits Alumni and Egoli Magic would have an upper hand going into the second half of the regular season. But that was not the case at all on Sunday.
The Pretoria Heat started the run of upsets after beating Wits Alumni 66-63 in a very intense match up. The Heat had Neo Mothiba fresh from a 19 hour trip from Cape Town where he was a manager for VUT. One would have thought that the last thing he would want to do was play ball after such a long trip. But the Heat saw blood and wanted to avenge their first round loss to Wits Alumni and probably couldn’t do it without the SA captain.
The Heat got off to a good start at tip off and scored 4 quick baskets catching Wits Alumni off guard on the fast breaks. Alumni eventually got their act together through Mboshe ronunu who started the game as shooting guard. Alumni trailed for the better part of the game through impressive performances from Joe Loo who couldn’t be stopped on the inside. He also got the crowd buzzing with a huge dunk on the fast break. Quintin Denyssen had an off day missing more open shots that you would expect him to. Kp Ndlovu also had a rough day in the office.
The Heat was carried by Neo Mothiba who ran point for the whole game. The majority of offense went through him either through driving and dishing inside or hitting jumpers on the Alumni guards. He also went to the free throw line a lot.
Alumni made a big come back in the fourth quarter through tough defense and excellent clock management and could have tied the game if luck was on their side. In the last play of the game, Alumni had the ball with 7 seconds left and they were down only 3 points. They managed to get the ball into the hands of Mboshe Ronunu who had an open three pointer but he missed the shot that could have taken the game into overtime.
The Heat deserved the victory and their campaign got off to a great start.
Wits Rebels also stunned Egoli Magic who lost 77-74. All the top teams have their work cut out for them if they want to make it to the playoffs. The league has now been thrown wide open.
Sfiso
The only reason you call those playas has been is because some of them actually have lost some of the interest in basketball.
What qualifies you to be a has been. In SA we have a problem of development, that is why players can still think of themselves as superstars way after their Prime. Shaq is a has been because of guys like Dwight Howard and Amare. Graig Gilchrist can still say he is the best Forward in the country because there is no other forward except for Kgwedi, he’s also 30,
Until young cats come up and force these so-called has been to hang their boots, hey they are the best we have at the moment. Dont blame the players cos they have confidence in themselves but blame the development.
Kweku thats still bad….I take pride in my speed…
Can i also jump in on the issue of defence. I think for a team to be a complete team they must be able to play both defences (Man on man and zone) as well as be able to play against those defenses as well.
In the modern basketball the team you line up on the day and the type of game you play should always revolve around the team you’ll be playing against. When on offense play against the defense given to you and on defence make sure you play it proper which ever defense you see fit for your opponents. So i would say it is vitally important to know all defences from a young age as well. But man to man is rather the best defence of all provided you have worked on it for ages cause it’s not something you can archive over a month, man to man does solve a lot of problems.
and we applaude you but reality proves differently.. And i agree with points being put accross about both defences.
Neo
I hear what you saying, but….
Development comes with giving those developed players a chance as well. What’s the use of developing players but come big competitions you go and get Craig? What’s wrong with Angola for example, you get Madondo what’s wrong with Nhlanhla. Players like Dwight Howard get given a chance and a responsibility at a young age while we still opt for experience than young talent.
Our young players know that there is nothing after you’ve gone over 18 and that’s the reality of the situation cause they go to universities to sit bench for more experienced/older guys like you and I then those boyz are eventually lost in basketball.
Again development comes with good coaching sklills which i seriously think we lack, we don’t have enough good coaches who are skilled or passionate about the game. Question is who develops then, tertiary? but then isn’t tertiary suppose to be a stepping stone for our national team players or PSL if it was in existance?
Our problem here in SA needs more than money and administration to fix, i think we need to do a serious change of thinking and that will elevate our sport even higher than were Angola and other Africa countries are. I know a lot of people would disagree with me on this but i think SA has more talent than Angolans but we just need a slap to the right direction. If there is any African country that can stop Angola it has to be South Africa but we are too blind to see that.
One of the biggest stumbling blocks to development in SA and especially Gauteng is the existence of the so-called ‘Giant’ clubs, think African Warriors, And1. How many teams played against these ‘Giants’ and actually thought they had a short at winning.
Personally I am against our best players playing in one or two clubs and beat everyone by more than 50 points, it is pointless and discourages competition.
Therefore, for bball to be competetive and grow it will be nice if our best players are shared amongst teams, then we can look forward to watching interesting matchups on a weekly basis.
Before you knock me down, this system is very evident in the NBA draft system, where the best college players do not necessarily play for the ‘Giant’ teams.
Joe
I once raised that point with the guys while at UJ but then my conclusion was some of these big name palyers actually are not but rely on some to make them shine and i can mention names (which i don’t think it’s neccessary) of the players who have since joining other teams hav flopped so bad.
That would actually bring back the competition in the game cause at this stage we play cause we love the sport but the excitment and the challenge has gone bye bye.
This debate touches on some of the core of sport especially competetive sport and why people play sport. To some players and coaches glorification is more important than development. These bballers cut corners in order to win and have the names mentioned amongst the great. This capitalist mentality of sport is detrimental to the long term development of the sport and will forever create fathom ‘elite’ teams and players.
The other school of coaches and players have a socialist view of sport, as you might have guessed I am one of them. In this school you will find coaches who will take a s***t player or team and challenge themselves to develop them into competetive bballers. Here you also find players who are good enough to choose which team to play for, but remain with their struggling comrades as they believe in shared victory.
Some of us knew Neo and Sfiso were good long before the played in Metro, remember the Gauteng Super League, flawed as it was. Some of us remember Taurus from the ICBL with Sunday and Joseph at the helm.
As ballers we have sacrificed the Leondale Chronics and Taurus of this world for the 15sec of fame. This teams were killed mostly by players deciding they are bigger than their teams not noticing that they were the team, without them these teams died.
What I am arguing is that players and coaches are as much to blame for the state of bball in as much as the politicians. Loyalty and comradie, which are some of the basic tenents of sport are always sacrificial lambs in the temple of the capitalist ‘I’.
Gone are those days and their teams, Alex Cavs (My team), ya ne you’re making a point. But most of us moved or jumped ship for different reasons, which might have been education (got bursaries to play in tertiary) or for the sake of growth. Basketball was long dying in the township because of the cash flow, in-order to play in better league than ICBL you needed cash and we didn’t have that so we decided to sell our souls for growth. So we could be part of leagues such as Metro and the likes. I guess it’s Loyalty vs Individual Growth which i think it’s not a fair challange.
I think the main issue not being discussed as far as the best way of teaching the sport is that the coaches need to be coached the right way. And that start with coaching clinics that are designed to cater for every level of development. We can debate the pros and cons of every technique out there but as long as you don’t start at step one its pointless. And we can criticise ABC for not holding clinics but there are people out there with the knowledge but I sometimes doubt that we are willing to listen to them as players, administrators or coaches.
Teach the coaches and the rest will fall into place. That’s my point of view.
ciao,V
Again, from the socialist perspective, this is where I also feel former players are to blame for lack of development in bball. We all jump to coach and run clinics at the rich school and forget about where we come from and what it took for that guy who schooled you without funds.
I feel once we have made it, it is our responsibility to go and give back to the Kasi clubs which build most of the ‘Giant players’ we have and continue to have. Case in point, I work for Monash SA and have worked for Wits, I could have easily given myself to these institutions. However, I chose and continue to choose to struggle with Kasi bball.
I am not saying that we should all abandon elite bball, but I am arguing that some self sacrifice is needed to properly develop bball quickly. For instance, one can play or coach at an elite club on a Sunday, but at the sametime be an owner/director/manager of a Kasi club or help manage a Kasi league or help train Kasi coaches this can be done on Saturdays.
Before people start saying there is no time, I have a fulll time managerial job 8-5, plus 2 kids after hours, and a wife 24hrs, and am busy with my postgrade. I am not special, I just understand that I need to sacrifice cause success measured on what I do for myself, pales in comparison to being judged for what I do for others.
This is a socialist thinking and maybe we need to start embracing it.
Here are a couple of so called big name players that have not being performing lately….I like mentioning names and calling people out- but this is not to discourage them and say they wack, this is just to say they need to up their game to get their respect back, if you know what im saying! Here it goes-hope I don’t get shoot!
1. Tsakane Ngobeni- I think he hurt his knee sometime ago but he needs to up his game
2. Lesego Molebatsi- Need to get fit and stop thinking he’s Kobe Bryant
3. Qiunton Denyssen- need to get them shots up like Neo (600 hundred a day)
Not picking on you fellows, just letting you know wzup!
Sfiso,
Again, from the socialist perspective, this is where I also feel former players are to blame for lack of development in bball. We all jump to coach and run clinics at the rich school and forget about where we come from and what it took for that guy who schooled you without funds.
I feel once we have made it, it is our responsibility to go and give back to the Kasi clubs which build most of the ‘Giant players’ we have and continue to have. Case in point, I work for Monash SA and have worked for Wits, I could have easily given myself to these institutions. However, I chose and continue to choose to struggle with Kasi bball.
I am not saying that we should all abandon elite bball, but I am arguing that some self sacrifice is needed to properly develop bball quickly. For instance, one can play or coach at an elite club on a Sunday, but at the sametime be an owner/director/manager of a Kasi club or help manage a Kasi league or help train Kasi coaches this can be done on Saturdays.
Before people start saying there is no time, I have a fulll time managerial job 8-5, plus 2 kids after hours, and a wife 24hrs, and am busy with my postgrade. I am not special, I just understand that I need to sacrifice cause success measured on what I do for myself, pales in comparison to being judged for what I do for others.
This is a socialist thinking and maybe we need to start embracing it.
I feel you Thapelo….dawg i feel you man
what an interesting debate..i hear what everyone is saying especially Neo, Sfiso and Joe..there are points that i agree with from all of you..going back to Neo’s issue on development and players having no-where to go after under 18 wjile some are benched at their institutions..i once raised an issue that as USSA level, they should not allow players that are over 25 to play at their championships and was shot down..
that is one other way of developing up and coming players. they need to be given a chance to improve..would Neo, Sfiso all you guys be playing for the national team if you were not given a chance??
Joe raised an issue on players doing coaching at private schools and forgetting their roots..that is what is killing our basketball to be honest..we need to invest in Kasi bball cos that is where hard core players are born and bred..most of this private schools play bball as leisure more than competitive sport and unfortunately they have all the money in the world to pay this guys..
imagine if Neo was to form a team in Soshanguve, Sfiso in Alex..then coach the kids on weekends after your normal day job..we sure need that dedication from all the bballers out there..
i am saying we need to invest in our townships..i mean look at soweto for example..how many courts are there..but then count the number of teams..bet they are not even more than 3..
we need to forget about fame or what-ever its called and focus on developing other kis as much as some coaches and players focused their energies to make you guys what you are today in bball..
lets plough back all the knowledge we gained over the years yo the under-priveledged township kids.
Guys, we all agree there is very little development in SA and where there is development someone else comes and takes the credit for your work so you get discouraged. People must stop pulling the race card, gender card and the political card to advance their own ambitions. Go do your own work on the ground then come and tell us about it
let face reality we(including myself) are killing our own basketball. i mean how can a player play for a varsity team for more than 9 yrs. there should be a rule that say a player is allow to play for a varsity team for 5 yrs unless the player does his or her master upwards. we have play doin the ND for 7 yrs just becuase the wanna play ball n the coach love them, so tell me in that 7 yrs how many plays decide to stop playing ball cause of 1 indivual. tell VUT for example, i start sassu games in 2001 there some plays who were there n they r still there. pls coach must not build there own cv but biuld player who can thing. Diablos Player peace out.
you cant force some1 to go and work on their game when they other things to do that food on the table. My argument is that who is most likely to heed a call to go work on their game? “the young ones” they have not reached that stage where they have kids and families to look after. We need to stop focusing on the tried and tested and try out new individuals. Im just lucky cos my job allows me to workout everyday.
We need to focus our energy on boys and girls who are going to be, not those who have been there. Its true those players mentioned have let their game slip but if asked why ? they give you the answer of satisfying the most basic need, the need to survive, and that would take time off their training.
It doesnt make sense for a coach to waste his time and energy on a player like myself where there are youngsters who are willing to learn. Im currently playing with a bunch of players from Soshanguve in the Tshwane League and the fact that I actually get on the court with them makes them feel special.
We have to give back to the community its where all of us come from and thats where all our roots will always be. I would really love to see the Loate brothers go back to Alex and do a couple of informal clinics or Kgwedi go back to Soweto and revive the once strong base of Gauteng basketball. In Pretoria we in the final stages of planning something for the kids.
Neo
I am usually very critical of Praise singers, but this is going to be an exception.
Big Up For the passion and dedication you show for the game. You are one of the Giant players that support bball no matter how small/big, hype/no hype, senoir/juniour. If only most of the Giant players would also understand that when one says ‘I Love This Game’, one must embrace every form of the game, not only the Elite Hyped Up version.
I also cannot agree with you more, players like Q have achieved what they can achieve in SA, until PBL comes back. Therefore we cannot expect them to be as passionate about developing themselves.
My wish, which supports your view, is that I want to go watch an U18, U16 match and see kids that play at higher leve than what we see currently. This is why I continously emphasise that the Elite game is not what we should be spending most of our time developing and dear I say watching, but rather the schools and the district leagues.
I therefore wish that this website will have more stories on developing bball than the Giants.
Joe,
you need a balance between the attention given to the so-called stars in SA and the upcoming kats.
You always need someone to look up to so that you have something to work towards. And from comments I’ve read on this site I’m sure that there are a lot of ballers gunning for the Neos, Quintin, Sifiso, Lesego, etc of this world. But please keep promoting both.
Joe
i agree with you 100%..our main focus shud be on the young players..that is where our future lies and seriously so..i once asked a question, if all the current SA national Team players were all to resign say this year, are we gonna get a team to replace them tomorrow..
the answer would be no..why??because there is no development..i think its high time that BSA gets involved in the affairs of school sports..
on the other hand, our school are hiring the sa called glorified players who completed matric from the same high schools to coach..how then do we expect this kids to be developed??
i hate giving examples but will refer you to the guy who coaches the Glen High School, the woman coaching Pretoria Girls High..they are lost in the game but because they studied there they are hired as coaches..
theses schools have good players lucky them but then the players but then the coaches can’t meet the standard the players are at..
to all of us, lets go back to grass-roots and help this kids..we have that responsibility..its not about money but for the love of the sport..
i take DSG where Neo is, believe you me i think that in three years they will have the best programme..i can bet my money on that..
Hey Baller,
Having been involved with the 2 schools that you mentioned above in the past namely, The Glen and Pretoria High School for Girls; I will beg to differ with your comment.
If you are talking about their 1st teams, The Glen won the league last year and Pretoria Girls High won the league this year and both coaches although young are knowledgeable and like all of us are students in the Game. You were saying that people need to go back to their roots so you are somehow contradicting yourself with the statement about expupils going back and coaching at their schools. I believe that you will always need someone at the school that knows the traditions of the school and that can relate wiht the history and the staff and even if you have someone that didn’t study at the school you need someone to facilitate the transition and the communication between the school. But both coaches at The Glen and PHSG have good basketball minds, are passionate and the best intentions with their teams. I know that The Glen didn’t perform this year for whatever reasons but PHSG were the same last year and they came back strongly this year.
I just think that these young coaches should be encouraged, given time and helped so that they continue their good work.
And as far as DSG, I believe that every school goes through cycles in every sport (cycles where they have a good quality of students coming in and leaving) and that is where the development at U14 level is so important especially at High School.
ciao, V
Players come and go, coaches come and go, but the tradition will always linger on.
Guyz
I for one am against ex-players coaching without even taking a day coaching coarse of something of that sort. Not every ex-player can be a coach and not even every best player can coach. We need to respect the coaching and not take it for granted cause the wrong mentality and knowledge we instill in those players will affect them in a long run.
The reason i think basketball dies at high school level it’s because of the mentality which these in-experienced and unknowledgeable ‘ex-player’ coaches instill in these players. Some players are made out to be superstars and think that they are bigger than the team (I know a lot of you know what i am talking about) . It becomes a big problem to coach such players when they get to tertiary cause they think they know everything already. Let’s not coach because we want to earn extra-cash but because there’s something we’re bringing to the game.
Neo
Are you playing in the Wits tournament with your team, i need a team guys to play for during the tournament? Hook the brother up